Ikarus

Welcome to the forum!

I wanted to ask in case someone told me that its a mental disorder (that’s the right term right?). I remember hearing that California labeled aromanticism as a mental disorder from a very reliable source. (Some random aro tik tok video comp I saw on youtube.) :p Anyway does anyone know if being aro was ever labeled as a disorder, because being gay was so I wouldn’t be surprised if aro was as well. I am asking about being aro alone, not other factors that people could use to say, “your only aro because your also x or y neuro-divergent, and all aros are neuro divergent”. Thats a separate discussion for another post. Its hard to find anything on the topic after a few searches. Would love to know so I can educate others if this question ever comes up.

Without a doubt im sure on my romantic orientation, although im now 99% sure about my sexual orientation. Oddly enough the hand thing (ya know… Rubbin pipe) helped me realize I had no interest in spilling the sauce inside someone. The 1% is (sex will feel good, don’t know until you try). Well no, because with the hand thing I have complete control. I dont know what benefit sex would give me that self pleasure doesn’t give and exceed in… Also there’s the fact that I might enjoy some sex techniques which aren’t Insert D into hole. If I enjoyed that type of stuff I don’t know how I would still be ace. Its just very weird to exclusively take interest in non hole related niche sex stuff since allos usually at least do some hole stuff. I might be a niche version of sex favorable ace under very specific activities. Oww…Im not as sure as I thought about my sexuality…

I have had this thought for a long time, why do people say they are PROUD to be aromantic/asexual/gay, etc. Obviously there is history behind pride month. The first pride which was a Stonewall protest in response to a police raid, the fact gay was labeled as a mental disorder, criminalized, discriminated against etc. Society at that time and in the modern day has bigots, and homophobes, and people trying to fix homosexuals. The response to this awful discrimination is, I am not ashamed to be who I am, I am proud to be gay / gays bi etc deserve equal rights etc. Also I don’t want to compare my experience to being gay etc. I am just talking about why people used the word pride as a response against societal discrimination, and we continue to use the term pride today. For me personally I don’t relate to pride and feeling proud of myself on a semantics level. I am not ashamed to be aromantic, on the contrary I am accepting of myself and love being aro. I just don’t feel proud to be who I am. Pride: 1. A sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect. 2. Pleasure or satisfaction taken in an achievement, possession, or association. 3. Arrogant or disdainful conduct or treatment; haughtiness. definitions from Wordnik I relate to the word pride in the sense that it’s the antonym of being ashamed but I stop there. What did I do to become aromantic? I was born aromantic, I never studied to get my aro diploma, nor did I unlock the aro achievement through deep meditation practice. Being aromantic alone doesn’t make me a respectable and virtuous person. I did nothing to become aro and being aro gives me no quality which is necessarily more virtuous than anyone else in society. Being aro isn’t a developable character trait, a faculty of the mind such as reason that can be developed through learning, a practice that can be challenging like meditation, it’s not a quality I can use to contribute to society on a significant level to better humanity. Being aro is just the way I was born, I am not ashamed of it and love being aro but I certainly don’t deserve any sense of achievement for simply existing as this orientation. Thats just what I think about the word pride I would love to see your thoughts. Do you feel a sense of pride being aromantic, and if so why? Do you feel unashamed and accepting of yourself and use those feeling to define your pride? Let me know what you think I am very curious to hear your thoughts.

I lurked around vrchat with an invisible avatar. Some furry got freaked out by a couch I was moving. They jumped up and said “Who’s floating that couch?” I also came across this epic prank

Instead of looking for a date me, and well I believe a lot of us are looking for other aros. Until recently I have finally admitted to myself that I want at least one friendship with someone who is aromantic. It felt strange to admit this because it felt like I was being very selective and singling a bunch of people out, which is only true if you want friendships with only aros exclusively. I haven’t made that leap yet, instead I decided that if I find at the very least one aro person (and we vibe and all) then I can rest assured that I will have at the very least one friend who will stick around. If I make friends with people who are allo then I may run a very high risk of experiencing the friendship disposability effect. I have a high chance of falling into this fate If I just sit back and passively wait for aros to show up during my life. Instead I realized for my life at least I want to take a more active approach and find at least one other aro, maybe two if thats doable at the beginning of my search but I may end up finding just one if I am being realistic here. An active approach involving selectively looking for other people who are compatible to you in a specific respect, well this approach kind of smells like dating. I feel a little repulsed at this idea but the end is not for romance, the means are just a little similar in a bare bones type of way. Look for a specific person or persons that share a specific compatibility to me, instead of romance it’s the lack thereof. Dating and Qprs, although I don’t know a whole lot about the latter but I believe I can say the two are selective, active, look for compatibility of some sort, and probably involve moving in together. On that basic level I find the means used in Dating and Qprs convenient for putting a rest to my doubts. My doubts about passively finding friends (Not searching for a specific type of person just finding whoever I like that comes along): The passive method leaves me to reason that I run the risk of having friends that won't stay around long term or frequently throughout the year. When my allo friends get preoccupied with their love lives I can have someone to be around meeting the need I have for a long term social life with others outside the internet and my parasocial connections haha. So basically I'm using the dating technique to find someone who is compatible to me in a broader respect (they are simply aro) rather than (feeling the romo a specific way with someone...is that even romance... I don’t know....) I wonder if there is a name for what I am trying to say here, because it’s not a Qpr, platonic relationship, romo dating, for me it’s just trying to find another aro to even out the odds in your favor for a longer lasting friendship. I guess I will call it the great Aro hunt, other names are welcome by the way. Anyhoot thanks for reading, I hope this was interesting or useful for ya.

My intentions where not to push my own view and poke my nose into how other people should coordinate their private lives. I just wanted to offer my thoughts on potential difficulties aroallos could have in these situations and the potential benefits to be had by saying you are aro for friendship situations. I wanted to create a conversation around this to hear what others thought about my reasons. If you don’t like my reasonings then your free to disagree, live your way etc.. All I was trying to say was not saying your aro could possibly lead to more drama, and I was very curious to hear if my ideas connected well with other aroallos, or if I was way of the mark about them in some way. I could have been a little more careful writing that response and I apologize if it sounds like I was trying to boss a bunch of people around so they would follow my ten commandments. Totally not my intention thought, I’m just curious about what people think about the benefits or drawbacks of saying your aro at first. You @Jot-Aro Kujo definitely have some good reasons though and I respect them, and I don’t mean to sound like I am parenting or giving you should statements. I was just curious about what you thought about my ideas. Also I appreciate your response to some of them, especially this response. Thats a very fair point by the way. By no means do you have to tell someone you are aro, but I am still curious to hear what other aroallos think. Do you tell others you are aromantic from the beginning? Why or why not?

Not only do I hate it, but its number one on my list of silly things people say to aros. To me those two words perfectly reflect the epitome of amatonormativity. The phrase is so subtle yet so condescending. Its such a common phrase though and I don’t think people even stop to consider the implications because romantic relationships are saturated into societies mind as THE ideal relationship for EVERYONE. The phrase is casually stating, romance is superior and friendships are obviously second best so me and you are just here for the time being until I feel the romo with someone type of thing. Where does that leave the rest of us? It leaves us with the fact that we feel disposable, no matter how long we knew the other person, how loyally we stick around throughout the changes of life etc. If Romance is so important than the natural consequence is friends being treated as 5th wheels. Its not fair or reasonable to believe allos attitudes can or will fundamentally change in any way, maybe just a little more respect for friendships would be nice. The best thing aros can do is to encourage more emphasis on friendships in media, books, the arts etc. because I think we are definitely living in an over romanticized world as we are also living in an over sexualized one. In my opinion the average human state has a little more balance, not a lot, but a little balance towards seeing the good in friendship. Maybe more than I am willing to give humans credit for but its hard to imagine people seeing friendship as almost equal to romance, dare I say equal. No way.... I know friendship use to be very important because I have an ancient book called Cicero on friendship, and the book describes friendship as the greatest good humanity can aspire to. “There is nothing better and more enjoyable than friendship in this world.” Marcus Tullius Cicero Wow.... Also it’s a pretty nice book if you want a philosophic and practical view on how an ideal friendship works and can also make you the best version of yourself. Thats all I have to say.

@Jot-Aro Kujo Your approach is understandable for that type of situation. If its casual sex meaning (unlikely to see each other again) then there’s really no consequence for keeping that type of info private. But if an aroallo is friends with the other then the situation can change. I just want to give a potential reason for why aroallos saying their aro before fwb type situations could help in avoiding unnecessary drama. I vaguely talked about avoiding breaking other’s hearts but thats not very clear. I think saying you are aro is important with friendships rather than saying “I will not love you romantically” (thats for casual sex). There is an Aroallo youtuber I have been watching for a while now (channel link: https://m.youtube.com/user/nikhampshire ) Anyway the guy Nik talks about awkward relationship situations where the other party expected him to begin feeling romantic attraction. He would have to remind the other person that he couldn’t reciprocate the feeling since he was aromantic. Imagine that the other party will inevitably feel romantically towards you and want you to reciprocate romantically to them. If the other party knows that you are aromantic, and understands what that means from the beginning then telling them you’re aro is a reminder, not shocking news. Although if the other party did not know you where incapable of being romantic no matter how good the sex, etc. there could be more drama. People might want an aroallo because “hard to get” or “I can bring them around cause its not like this person can’t love romantically.” Telling them that “you can’t love them romantically”, is very different from “you won’t love them romantically.” The latter has a possibility, however slight, that you may open up to them romantically if fate be willing. No hope of romance is a better message to give than false hope. If you don’t explicitly state your Aro and make an attempt to help them understand then they could feel heartbroken later on. Saying your aro from the get go could help avoid this drama by giving them realistic expectations. Just wanted to clarify why I think that and have an excuse for sharing an aro youtube channel. Nik is actually a fairly famous aro influencer / youtuber, he was on with Anthony Padilla, (the I talk to aros/furries/outcasts/internet celebs etc.) thanks for reading all of this if you did, I hope it was useful.

Ok I will get right to the point, I have seen comments and posts around the internet from aroallos who all seem to describe a specific type of dilemma they face. The problem stems from amatonormativity which affect societal attitudes and even peoples moral views towards aroallos. Imagine that an aroallo that knows they are aro enter a new relationship with someone, tells them they are aro and the two communicate what they are comfortable with to each other. The other party knows that you are aro, everyone understands what that means for this relationship, and the persons consents to an aromantic relationship which operates like a friendship, qpr, etc. . The two also consent to have sex at times without the romantic bonds understanding the other cannot reciprocate romantically etc. Now this is where the dilemma arises, consensual sex without the romantic implications is a big issue for many allos. I have heard different aroallos experiences about being judged for entering these relationships with others. Amatonormativity dictates that everyone who feels sexual attraction should also feel romantic attraction towards those they love. If an aroallo does not feel sexual attraction towards those people than these types of people are “selfish because they are only gratifying themselves and don’t love the other in a committed romantic relationship. Therefore they are taking advantage of others to fulfill their own needs which makes them either womanizers, makes woman sluts, and makes both dirty rotten scoundrels.” This is essentially the societal view which escalates from everyone should feel romantic and sexual attraction to casting judgement to aroallos for not strictly conforming to this system. Even moral claims can be made, that these relationships are inappropriate, and taking part is abusive behavior, or if you do take part especially if you are a woman you are either the victim of an abuser or you are a slut. These are very different issues, and very different consequences that could be faced that I will never face because I am aroace. Aroallo relationships with others can be potentially damaging to ones reputation, and these insults can be motivated by a very passionate moral vigor. I don’t have to face this same danger as an aroace, instead I would just get called confused or you have some type of mental / physical disorder (which aroallos will probably face as well), or a number of other things but not a moral condemnation and being treated like I am terrible human being... I don’t think I would have to face this problem with my relationships since I don’t want sex with anyone while being aromantic. The reaction that some people give to these relationships expose a different form of amatonormativity. I find it interesting how sex without romance can bring so many negative judgements, these two human experiences are probably very intertwined in many allos minds as the ideal relationship all should pursue. Have you (aroallos) ever been judged for your relationships with others that involve sex without romantic attraction. A follow up question, do you feel that your family or friends would judge you for being in these type of relationships? I also don’t want to understate how important it is to state that you are either aro or won’t commit romantically before entering a consensual sexual relationship with someone because if there is no understanding from the beginning then people could feel very hurt. Aroallo sexual relationships is one of the reasons it is very important for aros to receive education about aromanticism while they are young so no one feels heartbroken later on. Anyway I would love to hear your perspectives because I feel that aroallos don’t get enough attention, and I feel that aroallo sexual relationships have very specific type of issues that should be addressed because they apply specifically to them and no so much for aroaces like myself.

Have you ever heard an allo person say, that person is way out of my league or, he/she is a 5 or a 3 or a 9.5 in the looks department? What I find the most odd is how important looks seem to be in romantic pursuits, I made another post a while back about lookism which explains this connection a little. Lookism is basically the bias that attractive people tend to have good personality, financially stable, healthy, morally superior etc. As an aromantic, the way I find relationships seems so very different from allos, but I think lookism is a big reason for this difference. The bias of lookism takes effect on everyone to some degree, but this bias is particularly strange in romantic activities. It seems to me that allos use leagues and number rating looks as a scoring metric used to determine the probability of romance or sex with a certain person. If a guy is 6 in the looks department and the woman he wants to attract is a 9.5 then he will probably have to compensate this looks gap with personality, charisma, financial security etc. How about a woman who is judged to be about a 3 in looks, she will probably have to try the same strategies, personality, making money, sense of humor. Although it would be very hard for her to find someone “out of here league” being at a 7 or 8. Lookism can be so important that allos stay in relationships with people based solely on looks. You have a guy for instance who begins a relationship with a very attractive woman, she is amazing in the bedroom and has a very pretty face. "She" was drop dead gorgeous, then she started talking. The woman has a very entitled and narcissistic personality, and she is a complete bag for conversations. Despite this many men are very willing to stay in this type of relationship for who knows how long, it depends. I think lookism also keeps like bodied people together, for example you often see chubby people with chubby people, skinny people with skinny people, tall people, less attractive people with less attractive people. It seems that lookism and leagues often determines the type of people allo people marry or engage romantically with. A less attractive nerdy guy for instance is rarely with a 9.5 woman, but if he is rich then maybe not. A woman who is a 4 is rarely ever married to a Chad. I imagine a lot of allos would tell that Chad, hey you can do better than that, look at these 9.5 / 10 woman. At the very least lookism and leagues seem to be a very important qualification before getting to know one another. Often times relationships have problems even starting if allos are in different leagues from each other. Lookism and leagues is at the very least, in my opinion the most important first hoop to jump through for allos. Could you imagine though someone approaching you and your friend and saying this. Hey, your a Chad man, you don’t have to settle for a 5 girl like this, come on man you gotta enter the big leagues man. What utter absolute cringe that would be my God! Anyway, that is all I have to say, hope you found this interesting to some degree.

I usually prefer being around others but I can also enjoy working on projects by myself. Although I do get lonely if I spend too much time just working and not enough time with others.

There where these two workers Bob and Jim, on their break Bob asked Jim a question. Bob: Say, why are we down here and our boss Leeroy is up there? Jim: Hmmm good question Bob, goood question. why don’t you go up to his office and ask him. Bob went up to Leeroys office, and said Hey boss! why are we working away down below and you get to sit up here? Leeroy got up from his seat and stood next to a hard brick wall. He moved his hand in front. Leeroy: You want to know why now? Hit my hand. Bob: um.. ok… Bob swung and Leeroy moved his hand just before Bob could hit his hand. Bob: Ow!! Jee that smarts Leeroy then said, now you know, and sat back down. Bob went back down to see Jim, and Jim asked him what happened to his hand. Bob then moved his hand so it covered his face and said see my hand? I want you to try and punch it….

Hi there Cosmo and welcome to the forum!

I would respectfully decline taking the assignment. Then I would have to spend an hour explaining how I don’t experience this romance thing. Also surely I’m not the only one who thinks the whole assignment seems personally invasive even if you where allo since it seems there is an area for your name… no anonymity? What class is this by the way psychology or something?

Experiencing romantic attraction would be terrifying, and the involuntary aspect of attraction can totally give one some anxiety, believe me this thought has come to me before as well. Unfortunately there is no magic way to prevent yourself from ever feeling romantic attraction but the way I see it, the chances of you in particular experiencing romantic attraction are lower than other aros. If the idea of experiencing romantic attraction causes this much repulsion, fear, and discomfort for you then you are even less likely to experience it than most other aros who very very rarely experience it anyway. Also, the romantic attraction that some aros do experience usually isn’t enough to significantly alter their social relations forever. You are already very far removed from possibly experiencing even a little attraction by fearing the idea of it, and even removed from other aros who don’t think much about the possibility of experiencing romance as a negative outcome. Bottomline you are already very very very unlikely to ever experience romantic attraction because of your fear of experiencing it. Also you're apprehensions towards romance could reassure you that you likely never will experience this attraction. Hopefully you found this a little helpful. I hope you find some peace of mind fellow aro, have a great day!

I’m ENFJ-A and aroace.

Well done, and I also love the little dot stars and how they go with the night sky. The minimalist depth at the bottom rocky region looks nice as well.

First of all I wouldn’t use the word squish at first. She might see that word as having the potential for a crush. A squish, even though it’s opposite of a romantic crush, might seem like the beginning of a crush to her. The word is basically an aro version of crush, without the romance. In general I would avoid any concepts or words relating to, or having strong romantic undertones. Instead of using the word squish tell her your feelings behind the squish. You could even address your concerns to her about taking what you’re saying as romantic interest. See how she responds to your feelings, test the waters gradually. If she understands what you’re getting at then maybe you could say aro’s call this feeling a squish. It’s important you explain to her why aro’s have the word squish. Remember she has probably never had to analyze her crushes quite like you, me and others. Aro’s analyze when others accept those feels and act on them. Aro’s sometimes discover that they never really had any crushes. Put her in your shoes, and she will hopefully understand the whole situation behind squishes a lot better. You could say, aro’s use it to understand their affections towards others which are often distorted by romantic peer pressure/ amatonormativity. Before aro’s know that one can have no romantic attraction they often try to fit in with everyone else around them so they feel normal. Aro’s use the term squish to distinguish their true feelings from one’s they believe they are supposed to feel but don’t. The term squish helps aro’s understand themselves better. Anyway, thats my take on it. Hopefully I was able to help you in some way.

Hi Andy, welcome to the forum! This place is a great morale booster for struggling aros, I think you’ll like it here. Look forward to seeing you around.

The only solution is to wear a big green shirt that says no romo. Every time they think you’re flirting, point to the shirt. “For example an aro says You are an awesome person” points at the big white bold letters after saying the compliment, NO ROMO.

You could be lithoromantic. Here is a helpful page on the orientation. https://aromantic.fandom.com/wiki/Lithromantic Why do I say this? You said you where afraid of losing those feelings. You also said that you lost those feelings pretty quick. Litho people lose romantic feelings pretty quickly after entering a romantic relationship. They can feel crushes, or desire people romantically but once those feelings are reciprocated, litho people lose interest. I agree with Roboticanary, look into your panicky feeling. Although theoretically this feeling could make some sense with a litho who has conflicting feelings. Interest while not being in relationship, and disinterest while being in one is an interesting situation that can possibly invoke a panicky feeling I suppose . Especially if this hypothetical litho doesn’t realize reciprocation triggers disinterest. Im just over using my specmatron at this point. Maybe my speculation will helps you in some way. Anyway, I’m not litho so take what I say with a grain of salt. Um… that’s all I have to say, happy identity travels to ya!

Hello Robin! Welcome to the arocalypse community, I Look forward to seeing you around the forum

At around middle school, 7th grade, my friend told me he had a crush on some girl. He didn’t have to tell me though, he always acted so oddly around her. He did some really awkward things around her too my God! funny times though…

You should probably give yourself some space from them so you can decompress, relax, hang around friend c a little bit more in the mean time maybe. After you get away from them for a while, you might feel a little calmer, and then you can be more relaxed/rational when you tell them how you feel about their behavior towards you the next time you see them. Take a vacation from your problems, and come back to your two friends with a clear head. That’s what I would do...