omitef

@Ice Queen I meant that everything you said is super relatable. "Since he is not available anymore, abstinence is like second nature to me. I don't even feel the need to... you know." Yeah basically.

I'm demisexual and all of this post is a mood

I'm romance-repulsed but I like soft-romo or, like, super reserved displays of romance, that carry power because the feeling is too strong to be named. 

I rewatched the first Pirates of the Caribbean a couple years ago, and I really liked Will and Elizabeth's portrayals of intimacy. There's a scene when they get reunited and they just stare into each other's eyes and grin. Wishing all IRL PDA could just be like that.

I just got into an open relationship with someone that I'm very romantically attracted to. It feels amazing to be around them, there's just constantly a logical detachment while I'm around them, where I physically and emotionally feel happy, but mentally think that the situation is absolutely ridiculous. I'm intensely aware of the feeling that I've lost control over my own heart. I'm romance-repulsed by my own feelings, and it makes me uncomfortable. But I want to work through the uncomfortable feelings for them. 

Had this realization after talking with @Dodecahedron314 on Discord:

As someone who just experienced romance for the first time as a greyro, I feel that romance is less about what you do with someone, but more about how you feel with someone.

The major difference I've noticed between romantic and platonic feelings is ego. I feel like there's much more ego involved in romance--it's all about how me and my crush can fit into each other's lives. In friendship, I feel my ego is less present. I just want my friend/squish to be happy, not necessarily in a way that's dependent on how we fit into each other's lives. For example, I've noticed that I can have a squish, and not desire a queerplatonic relationship. But when I have a crush, I desire a romantic relationship, and I feel like I won't be satisfied unless I'm in a romantic relationship with my crush.

Why is a romantic relationship so desirable in the case of a crush, for me? Because of the benefit of couples privilege. First off, it's socially acceptable to publicly be affectionate with someone, romantically, than platonically. And when I have a crush, I want my affection towards them to be socially recognized and legitimized. But more importantly, I want my crush to recognize and legitimize my affection, specifically through a romantic relationship, because it formally acknowledges that I have a special role in their life. 

How does this differ from a queerplatonic relationship? Again, lack of ego. My interactions and displays of affection for my queerplatonic partner, are less about us recognizing that we are special to each other, and more about recognizing the specialness of the bond we share. 

Bonus: How does this differ from a special interest (for my neurodivergent aros)?

Hey, Ryan,

It actually sounds like your ex is pretty sure of what she feels? I don't see how explaining that there's nothing wrong with being aromantic would encourage her to marry you. As an aromantic person who's had exit romantic relationships several times, I think what prompted me to leave wasn't insecurity about my aromantic identity, but stress from trying to force myself to do things I didn't want to, to meet the needs of my non-aromantic partner.

Your ex said that the only reason she didn't want to marry you was "lack of feeling." Forgive me for being blunt, but what is the purpose of asking more questions here, when she's given you such a clear answer? I don't understand what there is to "work out" between you two--if a person doesn't want to do romantic things with you, because they don't have romantic feelings, shouldn't you just accept how they feel, and stop trying to do romantic things with them? If she doesn't want to marry you, or be in a relationship with you anymore, there's nothing you can do to change that. It's not your fault that she has no feelings for you. It's not that you didn't try hard enough as a partner. Feelings don't follow logic and they're outside our realm of control. But what you can control is how you react to how she feels about you. I know that it's hard to let go of her. But it's going to hurt more if you keep holding onto unrealistic expectations for both of you. And if you're holding onto unrealistic expectations until she shuts you down 100%, then you're just delaying the inevitable. 

On being aromantic, there are many posts on this site, where people share their experiences of being aro. Medical journals, not so much, but I don't think that scientific research has been very respectful or understanding of the LGBT+ community to start with. I can talk about my experiences with ending relationships as an aromantic person. Maybe they'll help you gain some insight into how she feels.

It took me a long time to realize I was aromantic. The first relationship I had, was with a good friend of mine, and I really wanted things to work out. But throughout the entire relationship, I felt like I was just going through the motions. It stressed me out whenever she wanted to hold hands, kiss, or make out with me. At first I thought it was just social anxiety, and after breaking up with her, I made a point of getting into more relationships to build confidence.

That was a bad idea. I remember Googling "how to break up with someone" moments after agreeing to be their boyfriend. The entire concept of relationships just felt extremely alienating to me. I knew what a good boyfriend was supposed to do, but I didn't understand why. Yes, you do things with your partner, because you love them, but I never felt anything remotely similar to romantic love during all my past relationships. I felt the stress of an actor onstage, of someone pretending to be a person they are not. I felt the excitement of planning gifts for my partners, of optimizing formulas to make them happy; I was more focused on building those formulas, than I was on building a connection with them. I understood romance theoretically, but not in practice. I eventually stopped trying to force myself into romantic relationships, because I realized I was just doing it for the sake of other people around me. I couldn't muster the courage to say "no" to romantic relationships, until I accepted that I didn't want to be in them. And I bet your ex probably thought the same.

I wish you the best of luck in wrestling with your confusion, and in accepting the conclusion of your relationship. I'm sorry that it took something as major as a proposal to end things between you, but with these things, it's better late than never.

I'd rather give up puns than get married.

On 6/16/2017 at 10:59 AM, Gingerplume said:

Now she's married with a mortgage and a dog,

^ My brain, which has a tendency to interpret things literally, read your sentence to mean that your schoolfriend was in some sort of polyamorous trio marriage with a mortgage and a dog. You have brought me much amusement for the night.

I feel like my extremely formulaic approaches to romance--and later, sex--ought to have been a glaring sign. I tended to think of getting a partner as a glorified, extended role-playing game where you say certain "romantic" or "sexual' phrases to capture the attention of your target--I mean, er, "interest"...like, "romance" and "sex" were two different languages I would switch to speaking, less because I was actually interested in romance and sex themselves, and more because I just liked to game the systems of romance and sex. I had "strategies" optimized for both games of romance and sex, but my greatest satisfaction resulted from the intellectual challenge of creating those strategies, rather than the successful results of my strategies.

@starstuff My current QPP just got a boyfriend and I'm not gonna lie, I've been alternating between extreme joy and extreme heartbreak since. 

I confess that once my close friends get into romantic relationships, I start betting when our friendship is going to end. Or perhaps, "end," isn't the right word? "Demoted in favour of romance" would be better. In fact, because of that fear and suspicion, I tend to preemptively "make myself invisible" whenever my close friends bring their romantic partners along in social situations. I third wheel myself. No, I completely remove myself as the third wheel, so that there are only two wheels, and I am not part of the equation...

Hey sorry for to anyone who's following this for necroing, but I just found @Robin's page on translating aromantic and asexual into Chinese, and I was thinking it'd be cool if aromantic was just 無戀愛. That way we could actually keep the term 性戀 to describe sexuality (which is conflated with romantic orientation regardless of what language you're speaking anyway) and the two terms would also flow well together:

Aromantic Asexual: 無性戀，無戀愛 (I know that directly translates into asexual, aromantic, but it just sounds better that way)

I also started writing up a list of possible Chinese translations for other sexualities...?
 

I'm offended because you have a name.

@SoulWolf She'd be patient and try to educate them, because that's who she is as a person. She likes teaching people about things. 

@SoulWolf Exactly--what hurts me is that even polite questions feel like interrogation. I remember trying to explain queerplatonic friendship to one of my mentors, and she was like..."so how's that different from being best friends? From dating? From friends with benefits?" and she was asking out of genuine curiosity, not dismissal, but it still upset me. I just thought, "I shouldn't have to be explaining this to you at all. I shouldn't have to tell you the difference...you should just understand that queerplatonic friendship is a serious relationship, and just leave it at that." I feel like I might just be too sensitive sometimes. 

For me, coming out is hard. Always. Coming out as trans is awkward, coming out as queer is awkward, coming out as aro, as poly, as grey-ace, as pan...for me, coming out is awkward because it inevitably becomes an intrusive Q & A session, where people basically ask me to defend my identity. I don't believe I should be obligated to come out, and yet, people have all these false expectations of how I should behave, and if I don't come out, they'll continue to have those false expectations of me...and I just can't stand that.

Therefore, coming out is not a choice, for me. It's impulse, and it's coercion. It's, "I need to be myself or I will die on the inside." I just can't stand the idea of not being myself so I try to make my identity crystal clear to anyone who interacts with me, ASAP. If someone won't accept me for who I am, then I don't want to be around those people. This is especially hard when it comes to family, and those whom I can't avoid interaction with; for them, I maintain firm boundaries. 

Yes, personal safety is an issue, but at what cost? Maybe this is just about being queer in general (and if you personally don't identify with queer, that's fine too), but I really feel like having a queer identity means you will either spend your life being dying by the acts of others, or dying on the inside. I believe that existence is resistance, which is to say that our existence is interpreted as an illegitimate act of violence within our prejudiced society, and that as a result, most of society thinks that we deserve to be treated as walking targets. 

So I run. I run towards people who I trust to accept me, and hope they won't plant a bullet in my face, metaphorically or literally. It's all I can do. 

39 minutes ago, Zemaddog said:

Admission to the Spudocalypse is 1 papo

NO! NOT THE PAPOOOOOOOOS

3 hours ago, Zemaddog said:

Wow, what's a bean?

it's this

@DeltaV Ahhh. That makes more sense. But there are still allos who fervently believe that they can be "the exception to the rule." Like I know guys who personally take pride in the fact that all their ex-girlfriends were lesbian (until they met him).

Also just for funsies my Anagori YMBAI test results:

1. Spoiler

    

   1. When you discovered the word “aromantic,” it felt like something finally clicked into place for you.
      Mixed feels. I knew about aromantic--and more specifically, lithromantic--but I feared the stigma of being arospec so much that realising I might be aro caused more suspicion than anything. 
   2. Identifying as aromantic makes you feel relieved, free, happy, or more like yourself.
      At first, no, I was scared as hell because of the stigma. Now? I'm confident and free and can't believe I didn't identify as aro earlier.
   3. When you discovered the concept of a “squish” suddenly a lot of things made more sense to you.
      Somewhat. Due to mental health issues, it was hard for me to determine which feelings were produced by genuine affection, and which feelings were produced by insecurity and fear. I went through a lot of deliberating before declaring that my past "crushes" were indeed squishes, because of conflicting information on the internet. 
   4. You have trouble telling the difference between romantic and friendly feelings.
      I used to have trouble, but now I don't. Unfortunately, I find that other people's definition of romantic/friendly don't perfectly match with mine, which pisses me off. I wish everyone had a strict, universal definition of what behaviours and feelings are considered romantic, and what behaviours and feelings are considered platonic. I'm someone who needs to have clear definitions and categories to interact with others, and when people are wishy-washy about their definitions and categories, I don't know how to interact with them. Because I don't know exactly what they need. 
   5. You’ve never had a crush on someone, or fallen in love.
      Eh. Love means different things for me as an aro. I believe love is friendship, and love is family. I've fallen in platonic love with my friends. I've fallen in familial love with some of them too. I have an aromantic definition of love, which means, "I am going to prioritize you in my life, and take care of you." And that kind of love, I've fallen into many times. 
   6. You’re not sure if you’ve ever had a crush on someone or fallen in love.
      No crushes.
   7. You have trouble telling the difference between a crush and a squish, or between romantic and aesthetic/sexual/sensual attraction.
      Not after much deliberation and introspection. 
   8. You have doubted whether crushes or love really exist, or if they’re just cultural constructs.
      YUPPPPPPPPPPPP.
   9. You find romance boring, annoying or upsetting when it appears in fiction, even if it’s written well.
      YES, USUALLY. It must be well-written and complex to not upset me. I recently rewatched the first Pirates of the Carribbean film, and I thought the romance between Will and Elizabeth was brilliant. Their intimacy is organic, intense, and earnest, and not revolving around PDA/lust/creepiness. 
   10. You once thought that having a crush on someone meant you admired them or really wanted to be their friend.
       YUPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP.
   11. You thought crushes were something you consciously decided to have, and selected an acquaintance or celebrity to be your crush, because everyone else was doing it.
       No.
   12. You forgot which acquaintance or celebrity you were supposed to have a crush on.
       Not applicable.
   13. If you’re not asexual, a “friends with benefits” relationship sounds ideal to you.
       I'm currently having a redefinition period about what ideal sexual relationship I want. I don't think I really want a sexual queerplatonic friend anymore, or even a sexual friend. I think a one-night stand sounds most ideal to me. I'm moving towards a relationship structure of aggressively split attraction, where I don't have mixed types of attraction involved in any relationship. That is, for me right now, a sexual relationship only involves sexual attraction, and a friendship only involves feelings of platonic attraction. And it's not something that I have to force myself to adhere to--it's just how I feel about people, right now. While I wouldn't be opposed to doing sexual things with a queerplatonic friend, I would never initiate it due to lack of interest.   
   14. You have trouble relating, or feeling involved, when your friends discuss their romantic relationships or romantic feelings.
       Yup. My default response is SHUT THE FUCK UP or YOUR CRUSH IS AN ARSE HOW CAN YOU FIND THAT ATTRACTIVE or ?????????????????????????
   15. Falling in love doesn’t seem very exciting to you.
       Romance does not excite me. Queerplatonic attraction and intimacy do excite me.
   16. You don’t understand why other people make such a big deal out of having crushes or falling in love.
       I do understand, from an intimacy standpoint. I think intimacy is beautiful--I think trust, honesty, and healing/growth through vulnerability are beautiful. I believe love involves desiring to be trusted, desiring to be honest, desiring to grow, and desiring to be vulnerable, with someone, and I think that's a big deal. Because we all start out as strangers to each other--we all start out alone in the universe. What are the odds of finding someone you want to connect with like that? What are the odds?
   17. You don’t understand why people do ridiculous, irrational or over-the-top things in the name of love.
       Hell yeah I do. I do irrational, over the top things for my close friends all the time. For the past two years I've been waking up at 5 or 6AM to Skype with my qpf in England, regardless of how tired or shitty I'm feeling. I stayed up to 3AM making soup for my now ex-qpf once. I spent like 2 days painting a watercolour birthday card for my best friend, even though I have no experience with watercolour--I just know she loves it. Tomorrow, I'm buying my other best friend dinner and we're going to sit on the rooftop and watch the sunset like we're in an anime and then we're gonna play videogames all night long because he's leaving for Spring Break the day after. It doesn't even have to be someone I have a strong, established connection to. When my friends are having personal or mental health issues and need someone to talk to, I drop everything and talk to them until I know they're okay, no matter what I have going on. Fuck, I'm queerplatonically attracted to some dude I met at a museum last week and I'm going to be travelling to some off-the-grid town in the middle of the desert that Google Maps doesn't even map bus routes to, because he's going there and said it'd be cool if I came with. I do irrational things in the name of platonic love, and I don't fucking care. Life is short, most people are arseholes to each other, and I just want to fight all the hurt in the world through aggressive, impulsive kindness.
   18. You don’t understand why finding someone sexually/aesthetically attractive would lead you to want a committed relationship with them.
       Yeah. For me at least, sexual and aesthetic attraction are superficial and fleeting. And I think it's dishonest to not reflect the superficiality of those feelings through action. I can't stand it when people act as if they love someone, when they really just love their body. 
   19. Or, maybe you sort of understand those things in an abstract way, but you can’t really relate to them.
       No, I understand those things, and I'm hella mad about the way most people are about them.
   20. You have never had a romantic relationship - not because you couldn’t get one, but because you just never really bothered to try, or you liked being single better.
       I had three because I suck
   21. When a romantic relationship gets serious, it makes you feel cold, distant or uncomfortable.
       Seriousness has nothing to do with it. When anyone gets romantic around me, or just starts aggressively hitting on me, it makes me feel cold, distant, and uncomfortable. I've Googled "how to break up with your partner" literally seconds after getting into a romantic relationship. I'm fairly romance-repulsed. 
   22. Getting a romantic partner feels more like fulfilling an obligation, or something you’re supposed to do, than something you’re really enthusiastic about.
       Yes. Absolutely. 
   23. Your romantic partners always seem to be way more into the lovey-dovey stuff than you are.
       Here's the issue: I aggressively devote myself to studying things that make my intimate partners/friends happy, regardless of my personal feelings towards the matter, because I want to be able to talk about things that interest them, with them. So sometimes I've found myself more into "lovey-dovey stuff" than my past romantic partners. I personally don't care for "lovey-dovey stuff." I just see it as a means to the end of making my partner happy.
   24. A likable person suggests having a romantic relationship with you, and you’re indifferent to it - you’re open to trying it, but you won’t get disappointed without it. Other people may find your indifference bizarre or think you’re giving off mixed messages.
       No. Not open. Slamming my door shut, preferably in their face, preferably against their face, preferably knocking them out. Mixed messages? No such thing. I only have one message and it is REJECTED. LEAVE NOW.
   25. You have felt guilty about not loving your romantic partner as much as they loved you, even though you sincerely cared about them and wanted to love them back.
       Yeah. Meh.
   26. You have felt suffocated, repressed or tense in a romantic relationship, even though you really liked your partner and they hadn’t done anything wrong.
       Yeah.
   27. When your last romantic relationship ended, you felt relieved and free more than you felt sad, even if your partner broke it off, and even if you liked them very much as a person.
       I felt nothing....#classicColdAro
   28. You’re more excited by making a new best friend than by falling in love.
       Uh, for me, making new best friends is love....so...
   29. You wouldn’t mind marrying your best friend and spending your life with them, even though you’re not in love with them.
       I would strongly be opposed to marrying either of my best friends. I would be fine rooming with one for life, but not the other. Confession: I am seriously considering moving to England to be closer to my queerplatonic friend after college, but I think it would be ideal if we didn't cohabitate, so we could have more independence and privacy.
   30. You’d rather spend Friday night having a sleepover party with your buddies than going out on a date.
       Yes.
   31. You want a best friend much more than you want a romantic relationship.
       Yeah.
   32. It’s not so much the idea of being single forever that bothers you, so much as being alone or unwanted.
       None of the three bother me--it's the idea of being hated that bothers me. It's the idea of being told that my identity is wrong, and that I need to "correct" it.  
   33. You are either oblivious to other people flirting with you, or feel uncomfortable or threatened by it.
       Threatened.
   34. You are sometimes perceived as flirtatious when you only meant to be friendly.
       No. I'm very explicit in communicating my feelings towards people, both in terms of words and action. If people continue to misinterpret my blatantly clear messages as mixed, that's their problem and their ego and their issue. 
   35. You live in a large community and see or meet hundreds of people around your age every year, but none of them have ever stirred romantic feelings in you.
       *side-eyeing the people at my university* Yeaaaaaaaaah.
   36. You recognize whether something is romantic or not by comparing it to other gestures, words and signals that your culture has taught you are romantic, rather than “feeling” the romance of it intuitively.
       For myself: the closest feeling I've had to romance is alterous, and I knew it intuitively. 
       For others: interpret based on other gestures, because I know their definitions of romance are different than mine.
   37. When you say or do romantic things, it feels like you’re following a script or copying romantic things you’ve seen elsewhere, rather than something spontaneous and natural to you.
       Yes.
   38. When thinking about what sort of person you’d want to date, your criteria are identical to what you would want from a best friend.
       No. I have no criteria for person I want to date, because I don't want to date anyone. That's like asking a fish, hypothetically, what ideal method would they want to walk on land.
   39. The main benefit you get from a romantic relationship is either platonic, sensual, sexual, or a combination of those; the romantic aspect is okay but it’s not really the part you like most.
       There are no benefits from romantic relationships, only much upset
   40. You have trouble imagining romantic activities that you would enjoy, unless those activities are also fun or interesting for you on a platonic or intellectual level.
       No, as long as there's romantic intent on behalf of the other person, I hate all the activities! The romance has tainted the intellectual and platonic aspect of enjoyment.
   41. You feel like your closest friends and/or queerplatonic partners are better at fulfilling your emotional needs than romantic partners would be.
       Yes.
   42. You would rather be huggy, cuddly or emotionally intimate with all of your friends instead of reserving your intimacy for just one person.
       Yes and no. I'd rather only be emotionally and cuddly intimate with only a select few, close friends. Intimacy just isn't something I can share with everyone; I need to get to know and trust someone A LOT first.
   43. You would rather have a queerplatonic relationship than a typical romantic relationship.
       Yes.
   44. You don’t feel as if you’re missing anything in your life right now; having a romantic partner might be nice, but you don’t need it or seek it out.
       Not missing anything. Having a romantic partner would be terrible.
   45. The idea of being single forever sounds awesome to you.
       I don't even consider myself single because single implies that I'm on the romance market
   46. You enjoy gestures and activities that are traditionally labeled “romantic,” but at no point during them do you actually feel attracted to whoever you’re with.
       Nope! If it's traditionally romantic I hate it. The fact that someone else is doing it with romantic intent just makes it worse.
   47. You don’t enoy gestures and activities that are traditionally labeled romantic, either because the romance aspect bothers you, or because all of them are just plain unappealing to you.
       *NODS FURIOUSLY*
   48. You avoid going places where people are likely to flirt with you, such as bars, parties, nightclubs, and concerts.
       *NODS FURIOUSLY* I almost died when my friend wanted to drag everyone to a strip club for her birthday. So glad we opted for mini-golf.
   49. You’re not sure why other people enjoy romantic stories; you usually just find the lead characters to be annoying, boring or dysfunctional.
       Ye. I like stories about intimacy, though.
   50. You like the idea of having a big wedding celebration more than the idea of actually marrying someone.
       No, I hate the idea of a big wedding celebration. In fact, that's the thing I hate most about weddings. I don't believe that expressions of intimacy should have to be publicized or extravagant. I think that takes the earnestness out of it.

    

    

On 3/6/2017 at 4:49 PM, DeltaV said:

Have you tried to make the characters have incompatible attractions? Might still be realistic if you keep the number of characters small. Or is this one of the excuses you've already tried? In this case maybe use aliens who don't understand the concept of romance.

 Ah see but then you run into the allo myth of "opposites attract" or the myth that anyone can open up to romance by meeting the right person. I'm pretty sure allos believe that it's simply impossible NOT to feel romance, and that all you need is someone to show you how "awesome" romance is, for you to get those feelings. Which is bull.

I was so confused I thought this was count to a million

*CACKLES*

My computer's really mean and died on me so I had to get a new one and set it up, which is why I've been absent and missed those glorious puns

I'm offended that you believe in reason