Aplatonic Aros

[hemogoblin]

Any other aplatonic folk about?

Anybody else as tired as I am, lol?

.

Been struggling with feeling valid recently because I've picked up calling or referring to a lot of folk as "friend" mostly because it's just a socially convenient words (and in some cases, to avoid hurting people), but it hangs over me and makes me feel like a liar or a fake. Thought it might be nice to speak with other apl folk and even see how they navigate this.

[illumi]

im panaspec which means i dont feel any type of attraction under any circumstances lol. i had to explain this label a few times; dk if you saw the definition before but ill add it just in case. i personally dont feel platonically attracted to ppl who are already my friends; not anymore at least. it just disappeared like that. i appreciate having friends but i have no desire to meet new friends nor deepen the bond of my current friendships [which are all experiences of platonic attraction]

its not that big of a problem for me tho. ive got ppl to talk to and thats all i need rn; most of them know im panaspec and a lack of platonic attraction doesnt impact our relationships so thats chill

[EGGHEAD]

i am currently questioning my platonic orientation again so i'll get back to you on that

[Lovebird]

Hello there!

[nonmerci]

Hi ! I call myself anattractional cause I don't feel attraction.

I guess I am an aplatonic plato-favorable as I enjoy having friends but I don't feel attracted to them.

I sometimes feel like that I am a fake or that my feelings are not real, but I know this is not true. It may also be linked to the fact that I recently started to ID as a loveless aro as well, but also to my contacts with the aro community as well : because platonic attraction is a big concept in the aro community, but not in the alloallo world, it never occurs to me that something was different about my friendship before. It is not a criticism but just a notice that it contributed to make my feelings sounds less real cause there is no attraction involved.

 

But at the end we are no liars, we just have our own way to live our relationships.

[hemogoblin]

On 1/30/2023 at 8:48 PM, Lovebird said:

Hello there!

Hi!

7 hours ago, nonmerci said:

Hi ! I call myself anattractional cause I don't feel attraction.

I guess I am an aplatonic plato-favorable as I enjoy having friends but I don't feel attracted to them.

I sometimes feel like that I am a fake or that my feelings are not real, but I know this is not true. It may also be linked to the fact that I recently started to ID as a loveless aro as well, but also to my contacts with the aro community as well : because platonic attraction is a big concept in the aro community, but not in the alloallo world, it never occurs to me that something was different about my friendship before. It is not a criticism but just a notice that it contributed to make my feelings sounds less real cause there is no attraction involved.

 

But at the end we are no liars, we just have our own way to live our relationships.

I'm aplatonic in the way where it's not about having or not having platonic attraction but because friendships are difficult, exhausting, and overwhelming for me. I do have some people online that I have maintained long-term relationships with that, and that I can deal with because we can disappear and re-appear in each other's lives, it's rather casual, there's no offline meet ups...it's overall just a lot less pressure and expectations. I always knew the way I related to the people in my life was different from the way they related to me. Like they could hang out every single day after and outside of school, and I was the one who joined in maybe once every couple of weekends. They all openly said they loved each other and hugged and cuddled each other, whereas Love has always felt like something I was disconnected from and uncomfortable saying, and I was touch averse. I care about them all as people. I knew them well - their ticks and likes and personality, and I respected them for all of that. But my needs around social interaction has always been muuuuuuuuch different from everyone I've interacted with. And for a while, I was pretty shielded from that because I was a loner and the people who tended to make me their friend were people who were alone and lonely and saw me alone and figured I'd be better to make friends with than trying to insert themselves into an established and cliquey group. So they were always very tolerant of my needs for distance (even if not of my disinterest in becoming friends, lol), even though they wanted more. But more and more people seem to be expecting friends to change for them instead of figuring out if they can just fit into each other's lives for who they are.

Oh yeah, I've never seen anyone outside of the aro community identify as aplatonic, much less respect it! And I've never seen anyone outside of the aspec communities yet identify with platonic attraction. I'm sorry you're also struggling with feeling fake and invalid. <3

I'm greatly enjoying about hearing all the different ways aplatonicism can manifest and be experienced as! Thanks so much for speaking up! And thanks to everyone else for joining in as well!

[Lovebird]

14 hours ago, hemogoblin said:

Hi!

I'm aplatonic in the way where it's not about having or not having platonic attraction but because friendships are difficult, exhausting, and overwhelming for me. I do have some people online that I have maintained long-term relationships with that, and that I can deal with because we can disappear and re-appear in each other's lives, it's rather casual, there's no offline meet ups...it's overall just a lot less pressure and expectations. I always knew the way I related to the people in my life was different from the way they related to me. Like they could hang out every single day after and outside of school, and I was the one who joined in maybe once every couple of weekends. They all openly said they loved each other and hugged and cuddled each other, whereas Love has always felt like something I was disconnected from and uncomfortable saying, and I was touch averse. I care about them all as people. I knew them well - their ticks and likes and personality, and I respected them for all of that. But my needs around social interaction has always been muuuuuuuuch different from everyone I've interacted with. And for a while, I was pretty shielded from that because I was a loner and the people who tended to make me their friend were people who were alone and lonely and saw me alone and figured I'd be better to make friends with than trying to insert themselves into an established and cliquey group. So they were always very tolerant of my needs for distance (even if not of my disinterest in becoming friends, lol), even though they wanted more. But more and more people seem to be expecting friends to change for them instead of figuring out if they can just fit into each other's lives for who they are.

Oh yeah, I've never seen anyone outside of the aro community identify as aplatonic, much less respect it! And I've never seen anyone outside of the aspec communities yet identify with platonic attraction. I'm sorry you're also struggling with feeling fake and invalid. <3

I'm greatly enjoying about hearing all the different ways aplatonicism can manifest and be experienced as! Thanks so much for speaking up! And thanks to everyone else for joining in as well!

It's super validating to meet other apl arospecs. I felt alone for the longest time because all aros would talk about is how friendship & platonic attraction is "more important" than romance and such. Which made me feel a bit unwanted I slowly realised I was apl, so I tried forcing myself to experience platonic attraction, didn't work lol.

 

[DeltaAro]

On 2/2/2023 at 11:33 AM, Lovebird said:

It's super validating to meet other apl arospecs. I felt alone for the longest time because all aros would talk about is how friendship & platonic attraction is "more important" than romance and such. Which made me feel a bit unwanted I slowly realised I was apl, so I tried forcing myself to experience platonic attraction, didn't work lol.

It never happened to me (or I gladly forgot about it), but many people told us here that they were literally (!) called heartless, robots, psychopaths, serial killers (seriously... wtf). So this explains the overcorrection that aros want to portray themselves as not this way, i. .e very social and interested in other people as friends.

Of course, I don't mean they just pretend, no they (except for a few aplatonic aros who want to fit in) really feel like this. But otherwise they wouldn't feel the pressure to make a big deal out of it.

[Guest]

.

Edited April 10, 2023 by Decaying Vegetables

[Lovebird]

9 hours ago, DeltaAro said:

It never happened to me (or I gladly forgot about it), but many people told us here that they were literally (!) called heartless, robots, psychopaths, serial killers (seriously... wtf). So this explains the overcorrection that aros want to portray themselves as not this way, i. .e very social and interested in other people as friends.

Of course, I don't mean they just pretend, no they (except for a few aplatonic aros who want to fit in) really feel like this. But otherwise they wouldn't feel the pressure to make a big deal out of it.

The aro community is lowkey full of hypocrites, they claim to support everyone on the aro spectrem yet freak out and call anyone whose aplatonic or loveless psychos/mentally ill/crazy and other borderline ableist terms. One of the many reasons why I don't go on aro forums much anymore is due to trash like this. Stop trying to palatable for allos because it ain't going to work and in the end, every aphobe hates us equally.

Edited February 4, 2023 by Lovebird

[hemogoblin]

On 2/2/2023 at 3:33 AM, Lovebird said:

It's super validating to meet other apl arospecs. I felt alone for the longest time because all aros would talk about is how friendship & platonic attraction is "more important" than romance and such. Which made me feel a bit unwanted I slowly realised I was apl, so I tried forcing myself to experience platonic attraction, didn't work lol.

Yeah, I think traumatic experiences made it more intense, but I've always been at least on the spectrum of aplatonicism. I still remember the day in high school I learned that my friend group only invited me to about a third of the things they did together because they knew I'd still turn down at least half of those. It's the day I really realized that my social needs are VASTLY different from most other people's. I was just like "y'all seriously spend that much time together!? how!?" Forcing ourselves to try and feel any type of attraction never works. D|

12 hours ago, Decaying Vegetables said:

At first I was about to say that I wouldn't call myself aplatonic, but now I'm not entirely sure. I desire friendships to an extent and I think I've experienced platonic attraction at least once. Though at the same time I'm also relating to some of the experiences listed by the other commenters.

I've always been highly introverted and reclusive. My social needs are extremely low and quickly overloaded. Because I was so quiet and aloof growing up most kids didn't interact with me. But the ironic thing is that I truly didn't mind, I actually enjoyed it since social interaction is stressful and draining. It always confused me how people needed so many friends and in particular constant social interactions so badly.

The times I deliberately put myself out there to make friends were mostly sparked out of necessity. Going through horrible times and needing support but family was no longer supportive and more understanding connections were needed. Or currently where I've realized that due to disorders and disabilities I'm stuck being dangerously dependent on family and trapped where I'm at unless I can make compatible connections I can fall back on. Or if I want to do kink play with safe partners I have to put myself out there and build trust first.

I also notice that I struggle with initiating and upkeeping contact with people. Not only because of anxiety and lacking social skills but because I just don't have the drive to interact. To constantly talk or share my life with other people, which is one of the core parts of maintaining friendships or most social connections really. Occasionally I feel the need but it's definitely not to the level that most seem to want. And basically all of the people I've befriended approached me first and kept at it somehow. The ones that last end up being the type to initiate and lead conversation consistently. If they don't, our interactions tend to just die out or remain brief.

I also severely struggle with saying "I love you" to anyone, including family. As well as most fluffy and affectionate language. It gets caught in my throat. Feels wrong and just not me even if I do greatly appreciate and cherish who someone is. So it can feel like a lie or a facade. And being touch averse just adds to the problem. (Unless it's towards cats, then I'll say it everyday with enthusiasm.)

I also feel uncomfortable calling people "friends" at first, not as soon as they always seem to want to use the label. But I know if I don't they'll get hurt and may not last to the point where I would be comfortable calling them friends.

So maybe I am aplatonic or at least "under the spectrum" somewhere. I just haven't thought about it much since the concept's very new to me.

Pardon the monologue, this made me think more about myself and I wanted to write it out.

As you may have come to realize typing this out, your experiences are pretty relatable here! You don't have to use any label you don't want, but you've certainly found the right thread to talk about these thoughts and experiences. =)

I need to talk about things a lot, but I'm usually good just venting about them to the stars. I don't particularly need anybody to hear or respond to me most of the time. Just putting it out into the universe is enough! Actually a lot of the time I end up confiding in someone else irl, I end up regretting it? I'm immediately like "nope, that could have stayed a Me Thing" and quickly tire of conversations with people trying to engage me in my thoughts and experiences. xD

[nonmerci]

18 hours ago, DeltaAro said:

It never happened to me (or I gladly forgot about it), but many people told us here that they were literally (!) called heartless, robots, psychopaths, serial killers (seriously... wtf). So this explains the overcorrection that aros want to portray themselves as not this way, i. .e very social and interested in other people as friends.

Of course, I don't mean they just pretend, no they (except for a few aplatonic aros who want to fit in) really feel like this. But otherwise they wouldn't feel the pressure to make a big deal out of it.

I can get it but they should understand when their rhetoric is hurtful.

I remember a discussion on reddit : an allo posted a message addressing to aros who are not comfortable with the label, which was nice, but says that we don't have to be sad about being aro because of platonic love and friendship. Some people answered that they appreciate it but that one should be careful to not make friendship the only reason why it is OK to be aro. Ironically, the person who posted the message perfectly understand; but there was an aro in the comment who say that aplatonic and loveless aros should shut up cause the message was not for them; and when I point out it is exclusionary that addresses to all aros only applies to alloplatonic aros, the person told me that I was not supportive of alloplatonic aros. Which is stupid cause I am all for messages about platonic love, I just think the wording is important.

 

So yeah, I can understand that platonic love is super important for some people and they don't want to be seen as lacking it; but they don't have to look down on aplatonic people for that. Saying "being aro is not connected to the ability to form friendship or to love in other ways" is a good message, they don't have to say "don't worry we love our friends, we are not psychopaths", which is bith aplaphobic and ableist.

[Lovebird]

19 hours ago, hemogoblin said:

Yeah, I think traumatic experiences made it more intense, but I've always been at least on the spectrum of aplatonicism. I still remember the day in high school I learned that my friend group only invited me to about a third of the things they did together because they knew I'd still turn down at least half of those. It's the day I really realized that my social needs are VASTLY different from most other people's. I was just like "y'all seriously spend that much time together!? how!?" Forcing ourselves to try and feel any type of attraction never works.

 

Yeah, I realised I also have completely different social needs. Also adding in that I'm autistic and find it hard to realise certain social cues.

[Guest]

.

Edited April 10, 2023 by Decaying Vegetables

[DeltaAro]

On 2/5/2023 at 12:02 AM, Lovebird said:

The aro community is lowkey full of hypocrites, they claim to support everyone on the aro spectrem yet freak out and call anyone whose aplatonic or loveless psychos/mentally ill/crazy and other borderline ableist terms. One of the many reasons why I don't go on aro forums much anymore is due to trash like this. Stop trying to palatable for allos because it ain't going to work and in the end, every aphobe hates us equally.

Every community has/had those ... accusations? Problems? Let's say "issues". So the personal question is, does X do more harm than good? Stay and change X, or leave?

Aplatonic is a hot button issue, because contrary to romantic relationships, you have some non-optional relationships, like with your parents. So that's the logic behind it for those aros to fundamentally distinguish aromanticism from aplatonicism and regard the latter as a character defect.

Generally, we live in a time when everybody presents themselves as absolutely, firmly believing the right thing, without even a shred of doubt, and then frame their opinions in a language of victimhood. E. g. just browse J. K. Rowling's Twitter posts.

So there is really serious contradiction, but no accepted meta-theory to settle those disputes. You can use history as a guide. But that's obviously imperfect since we live in a globalized world, while the history of societies differs greatly.

TW: very flame war prone material

Spoiler

 hijab = a symbol of gender oppression VS. hijab = a symbol of freedom

Also, some issues simply lack any historical precedent. Maybe we should just all be more reticent and less judgmental. OK, I start with this now... This is one of the post that I regret posting, though I have much more material. For a whole book... 😆

Edited February 15, 2023 by DeltaAro

[hemogoblin]

On 2/6/2023 at 6:19 AM, Decaying Vegetables said:

Normally I process everything internally but when I have opened up to others for minor things there's been many times where it felt lame and pointless afterwards even if they were technically supportive. And a few times with important problems where it went horribly and just reinforced my fears and tendency to bottle everything up.

Oof, yeah, I feel this hard. The difficult things to talk about are always the most fraught, and it's just not worth it when they go poorly. =\

[Lovebird]

2 hours ago, DeltaAro said:

Every community has/had those ... accusations? Problems? Let's say "issues". So the personal question is, does X do more harm than good? Stay and change X, or leave?

Aplatonic is a hot button issue, because contrary to romantic relationships, you have some non-optional relationships, like with your parents. So that's the logic behind it for those aros to fundamentally distinguish aromanticism from aplatonicism and regard the latter as a character defect.

Generally, we live in a time when everybody presents themselves as absolutely, firmly believing the right thing, without even a shred of doubt, and then frame their opinions in a language of victimhood. E. g. just browse J. K. Rowling's Twitter posts.

So there is really serious contradiction, but no accepted meta-theory to settle those disputes. You can use history as a guide. But that's obviously imperfect since we live in a globalized world, while the history of societies differs greatly.

TW: very flame war prone material

  Hide contents

 hijab = a symbol of gender oppression VS. hijab = a symbol of freedom

Also, some issues simply lack any historical precedent. Maybe we should just all be more reticent and less judgmental. OK, I start with this now... This is one of the post that I regret posting, though I have much more material. For a whole book... 😆

You make some great points. Also, I'd love to see like, a history of aplatonic people, but that would be hard as it's not that well known of a label and it could be "debatable" on who would be a prominant aplatonic individual.

[hemogoblin]

Mini-poll: what are my fellow aplatonic folks views on pets?

I'm personally not a pet person. It's a combo of not being able to devote that much love, time, or attention to any being and knowing a domesticated animal needs to be loved and taken care of and a bit of a germ thing where I can't just casually touch and hang out with animals like other people can. Petting/cuddling them has to be a specific action with a specific time limit, and then I need to go get cleaned. Plus allergies+asthma just make it soooooooo much nicer to live without any pet dander.

Writing this made me curious if there's any aplatonic folk here interested in being a parent? (Again, I'm personally not. Kids are awesome, but I like going home at the end of the day and not being responsible for teaching them how to be good people and how to navigate the world.)

Edited February 24, 2023 by hemogoblin

[nonmerci]

I like pets but I don't know if I want one for myself. When I was a kid I wanted a cat and to this day I still prefer them over dogs. First I don't like how dogs smell, second cats are more independant and I like that about them.

 

On 2/24/2023 at 11:04 PM, hemogoblin said:

Writing this made me curious if there's any aplatonic folk here interested in being a parent?

I always wanted children. When I was a kid I wanted three. Now I think that one is already great. I planned to start adoption procedures in two years, when my appartment will be built, so I no longer live with my parents.

[illumi]

On 2/25/2023 at 6:04 AM, hemogoblin said:

Mini-poll: what are my fellow aplatonic folks views on pets?

cats lives in my brain rent free but theyre the only animal i will take as a pet since im the most familiar with them; theyre like goofy cuddly buddies to me. free serotonin everytime

[nonmerci]

I'm just mad about something that happened. TW aplaphobia (is that a word? If it were not now it is).

Basically, someone comes in the aplatonic subreddit and says something about how being shy is not a sexuality (as if we pretended aplatonicism was a sexuality) and how we just have no social clues and should cure our sociopathy. Most people said it was offensive of course, but there were also a comment about how if we don't want friends we need therapy.

It just annoys me so much. If someone is happier without friends, why on earth would they seek therapy to change that? People are just projecting their own needs on others and thisbis dangerous.

Also, though I'm not sure that the two people saying that were aro or not (I think only one wasn't), but it just reminds me a problem I have with some aro people who tend to replace romance by friendship in the amatonormative discourse. Like, they will tell about how romance is not needed to be happy or normal, but will talk about how platonic love is. I just don't get it : why can't we just get rid of the idea that their is an universal way of being that is good for everyone, and just let people define for themselves what they want and need in life?

[entropyseasystem]

On 2/16/2023 at 1:24 AM, DeltaAro said:

Every community has/had those ... accusations? Problems? Let's say "issues". So the personal question is, does X do more harm than good? Stay and change X, or leave?

Aplatonic is a hot button issue, because contrary to romantic relationships, you have some non-optional relationships, like with your parents. So that's the logic behind it for those aros to fundamentally distinguish aromanticism from aplatonicism and regard the latter as a character defect.

Generally, we live in a time when everybody presents themselves as absolutely, firmly believing the right thing, without even a shred of doubt, and then frame their opinions in a language of victimhood. E. g. just browse J. K. Rowling's Twitter posts.

So there is really serious contradiction, but no accepted meta-theory to settle those disputes. You can use history as a guide. But that's obviously imperfect since we live in a globalized world, while the history of societies differs greatly.

TW: very flame war prone material

  Reveal hidden contents

 hijab = a symbol of gender oppression VS. hijab = a symbol of freedom

Also, some issues simply lack any historical precedent. Maybe we should just all be more reticent and less judgmental. OK, I start with this now... This is one of the post that I regret posting, though I have much more material. For a whole book... 😆

Relationships with parents are also optional tbh. You can cut them off if you want. Also thats probably more about familial repulsion and/or afamilial spectrum 

[Lovebird]

On 2/25/2023 at 9:04 AM, hemogoblin said:

Mini-poll: what are my fellow aplatonic folks views on pets?

I like animals, but I can live without them too, it's similar to how I feel about humans in general. Parrots are my favourite, though they require a lot of attention and care, and I cannot really keep up with that currently. I also love cats, so I may adopt one.

[Picklethewickle]

I'm aplatonic. I can find people interesting and likable, but I don't feel a need to bond with someone as a friend. Friendships can be nice in small doses, but overall maintaining a friendship is a lot of work and can be more burdensome than anything. I very much prefer casual acquaintances and communicating with people through the internet over pyhsically getting together and spending time with people. I've also noticed that I don't find the end of friendships painful. I've seen many other people grieve the end of a friendship, but to me these kind of life changes are healthy, normal, and easy to accept.

[DeltaAro]

On 4/24/2023 at 2:54 PM, entropyseasystem said:

Relationships with parents are also optional tbh. You can cut them off if you want. Also thats probably more about familial repulsion and/or afamilial spectrum 

Of course, it is legal and the laws of nature permit it. But is it really 100% morally neutral? I doubt it (provided you had loving parents). I don't want to demonize anyone, but it just feels bad. At least, it is a lack of basic gratitude.

With some random adult person who wants to be your friend, but you don't want to be their friend, it's just a case of "sad day for you".