Jump to content

Civil War


Blue Phoenix Ace
 Share

Recommended Posts

I'm talking about the American Civil War... North vs South... (ok not really)

 

So, who's seen the new Civil War movie? I thought it was really good. The reason the Avengers got split into two sides was fairly compelling. Most of the screen time was with Chris Evans and Robert Downey Jr, but Falcon and Winter Soldier got quite a bit of time too. The acting was really good overall. The rest of the characters weren't quite as fleshed out, but there just isn't enough time to focus on 10+ main characters, so I thought that was OK. Spiderman made an appearance and turned out to not suck, so I think that we will see a great re-re-reboot of that series. Ant Man was super cool, and of course Paul Rudd was funny as usual.

 

I definitely recommend it. It was very entertaining with a decent story.

 

Movie Spoilers Within:

 

 

My main concern with the movie was how Captain A handled the Winter Soldier. Had he simply allowed Bucky to be captured by the police, there would have been a lot less lives endangered. Bucky would have been proven innocent for the bombing, since Ironman had the proof before the movie was over. The kind folks at SHIELD could have helped to deprogram his Hydra brainwashing and all would have been well.

 

Another plot hole, with the whole fight at the airport. It was a really cool scene, but if they were trying so hard to get to the Jet, why didn't Ironman have a remote control to just have it leave? Also, how did Ironman even know they would meet at the airport, and why did Cap spend so much time recruiting people when he could have just followed his lead to Siberia?

 

And the worst part, how did the guy orchestrating the final fight between Cap and Ironman even know they would both show up, at the same time... as him. Why not just email the footage of the car accident and Bucky's murder of Ironman's father to Ironman and just wait for the sparks to fly? Why did he put himself into so much danger to even find those frozen soldiers in Siberia? He didn't have to do any of that.

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I saw it the day it came out and really enjoyed it :) I don't really have anything constructive to add because I was watching it for cool action scenes and funny one liners. Although now I've read your plot holes I can totally see them myself

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also really enjoyed it! I don't think I was looking too hard for plot holes 'cause... They're obviously gonna be there :P  Avengers 2.5, basically, is what it was.

 

Although the main thing I didn't like...

CAP THAT WAS PEGGY'S NIECE

DIDN'T YOU THINK THAT'S A BIT WEIRD

YOU WERE JUST AT HER FUNERAL

SHOULDN'T YOU KINDA TALK ABOUT THAT

I knew Peggy was gonna die but damn, it still really upset me. I think mainly because I really liked the TV show..

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was really excited to see Black panther as well. I though he was pretty awesome. :D Also, I agree that the conflict was handled decently well. From what I've heard, in the comics it was kinda implied that Iron Man's side was Teh Bad Guys. I liked that in this movie, I saw both their points and kinda agreed with both.

 

Simowl, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought that.

Seriously, everyone's writing how the romance was "so well done" and I'm just like, EW NO.

 

hehe, the final fight thingy. It's like in all the movies when stuff happens with ridiculous coincidences.

I'm so excited to see Wakanda, the little glimpse we got was awesome.

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, RedNeko said:

 

  Hide contents

Wait, people thought that was done well? On what basis?!

 

I just saw some people commenting online that they thought that relationship was "well-written" and such. I didn't read a lot of analysis.

Honestly, even ignoring the whole "I dated your great aunt" angle, I think it really came out of nowhere.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Vega said:

 

  Hide contents

 

I just saw some people commenting online that they thought that relationship was "well-written" and such. I didn't read a lot of analysis.

Honestly, even ignoring the whole "I dated your great aunt" angle, I think it really came out of nowhere.

 

 

Yeah, I thought it came out of nowhere too

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry, if you haven't seen the movie yet then you aren't privy to most of this thread content. :)

 

The romance was well written in that all it involved was a single kiss. They didn't dwell on it, they just went on with the movie. So, thank you Marvel for sparing us that crapola. :)

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I liked it. Its so refreshing after the grey doom and gloom that DC is at the moment.

 

Like they used actual African languages? I liked that there wasn't really a bad side, they actually went for a conflict between likeable characters with legit motivations? Black Panther being the one to come up with the 'eye for eye and we all end up blind' thing, a vague reference to Martin Luther King? Scarlet Witch commenting on the bastardized, bland attempts of ethnic food?

Captain finally isn't the all-good golden boy, and Bucky is still has otter vibes...aaand they kept the good old queerbaiting. It would have been brave if instead of the creepy het 'romance' out of nowhere, they would have gone for representation.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Cassiopeia said:

Yes, @RedNeko there is subtext. So much subtext, the director had to address  it in an interview. So much subtext, it sold the movie to thousands of people, mostly straight women.

 

Wow, the director has had to address it? That's pretty extreme.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, RedNeko said:

Wow, the director has had to address it? That's pretty extreme.

Yeah, they were ~really vague~ about it. You know, this way the shippers and/or queer people still go to see if there is any canon action, but also straight boys aren't intimidated by it.

 

At least they don't deny it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

my big thing is that there wasn't really a resolution??

 

 

 

 

like t'challa coming up with the whole "vengeance is bad" right in the proximity of tony, steve, and bucky beating the shit out of each other? i was almost expecting him to try and stop them (tho it probs would have been dangerous... like he has a cool supersuit but it cant protect you from everything....not even bucky's arm was safe....) HOWEVER the movie gave a good lead-in into that happening and then let them friendmurder each other

 

idk i just wanted the movie to end on a happier note than it did :( 

 

 

also re: queerbaiting: it was definitely there. i hate it because every time two characters who could be in gay with each other get familiar, i think 'oh yeah this could totally work theyre actually going to do it' and i get my hopes up? and then it doesnt happen and im Anger. i guess i havent lost my faith in humanity yet lmao

 

edit: i just read the article that @Cassiopeia linked and oh my GOD yikes all it says to me is that the director wants to win favor with the queer fanbase (and str8 women who think stucky is HAWT) without pissing off conservative viewers :/ like its so vague??? 

 

Quote

“People can interpret the relationship however they want to interpret it . . . People have interpreted that relationship all kinds of ways, and it’s great to see people argue about it what that relationship means to them. We will never define it as filmmakers, explicitly, but however people want to interpret it they can interpret it.”

 

 yikes???

 

Quote

For us, we’ve always interpreted the relationship as two brothers. 

 

double yikes???

 

tl;dr: yikes

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm always so torn about those things. Because on one hand, I definitely agree that two people caring about one another doesn't make them in love or anything more than just friends.

My problem is that happens only with same-sex couples/friends. I mean that same-sex people always "just see each other as friends" whereas other-sex couples almost always realize that they were in True Love (TM).

So yeah I'm all for people caring about each other like brothers or friends but it shouldn't come at the expense of same-sex representation.

 

Also, two men who grew up in the 30s/40s dealing with the realization they are gay would be fascinating.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, RedNeko said:

I think something which makes any queer baiting issue worse is that the whole 'death of the author'/open interpretation thing has become so popular.

 

Become? It isn't exactly a new thing.

What's new that the authors actually admit that there is a queer subtext. 20-30 years ago they just had the same kind of queerbaiting, made huge piles of money with it, and when questioned about it, they just shamed their own fanbase and told them they are delusional and perverted...

 

30 minutes ago, Vega said:

My problem is that happens only with same-sex couples/friends. I mean that same-sex people always "just see each other as friends" whereas other-sex couples almost always realize that they were in True Love (TM).

So yeah I'm all for people caring about each other like brothers or friends but it shouldn't come at the expense of same-sex representation.

 

Also, two men who grew up in the 30s/40s dealing with the realization they are gay would be fascinating.

 

Plus there is the fetishization. Because this is the same category as the two-girls-make-out-so-the-male-fanbase-has-something-to-jerk-off-to trope.  It does not address actual queer issues (like the one you mentioned), their sexualities are not part of their identities, they are only gay for straight consumption.

And as a result straight people do treat queer people as IRL porn.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Cassiopeia said:

Plus there is the fetishization. Because this is the same category as the two-girls-make-out-so-the-male-fanbase-has-something-to-jerk-off-to trope.  It does not address actual queer issues (like the one you mentioned), their sexualities are not part of their identities, they are only gay for straight consumption.

And as a result straight people do treat queer people as IRL porn.

Ugh yeah, that too. I've heard really creepy stories.

 

And just from a storytelling sense, it's a pity because it would be a different story than the ones that are presented in mainstream media. Just in that sense, it would be more interesting. Because we've seen the "woman falls in love with the hero and becomes useless/annoying" story about a million times. And to present queer issues (well) in a mainstream movie which attracts a different crowd from the ones that usually watch queer-coded movies could do a lot of good.

I'm so disappointed because it seemed like Marvel was doing decent, there were interesting female characters and at least some side characters were not white and I thought that more would come but now we're into phase three and we still have not gotten a movie starring a nonwhite or nonmale or LGBT+ character. (I know some are coming, but still. No non-cishet characters even promised.)

And on a similar note, has anyone else noticed that when a character is a minority they're a member of only one minority group? Everyone is assumed straight, and we've got three black men, and two white women.

 

In a way, I do understand consumption of queer romances, just because all my uncomfortable experiences with romance have been other-sex, so I feel safer consuming media with lesbian relationships, and being a cis woman, male-male relationships are in some way separate from me. But I get that's not an issue many hetero allosexuals would have.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...