Lovebird

Victim-blaming people for being rampantly harassed isn't cute, regardless of wherever they're allo or not. I've literally seen aros do almost the exact same thing. You've clearly misunderstood what I mean when ALL cringe culture is bad. There's no such thing as 'good' cringe culture.

I just believe that at the end of the day, none of us have the right to shame each other, and there's never a greater or lesser evil when it comes to this. Our existences, both aspec and non-aspec, are very complex and deserve respect, each of their own - and it shouldn't be tolerated when someone (regardless of whoever they are) turn their experience of something into an excuse to shame another person. I am not saying people don't have the right to talk about how romance and sex has negatively affected them. Sometimes it's easy to become mad at the world and at random people because of how saturated romance and sex is in multiple cultures. But, it shouldn't be excused if someone takes that anger out and utilizes it as shame.

No, there is no good "cringe culture". At least if we define "cringe culture" as coming from a desire to mock and shame innocent people. This is indefensible, no exceptions. Good that I didn't defend cringe culture then. And blaming victims of online harassment is just awful. Good that I didn't engage in that.

Some threads here on this board admittedly give off a very strong cringe culture vibe, e.g. "Things you've never understood about romance". Similarly, all the many posts like "Isn't <something romantic> weird?"

And yes, this may feel hostile and off-putting for those who experience romantic attraction or are favorable towards it. I understand that.

(That was the context, very obviously, not some hypothetical aro who uploads screenshots from a dating profile of a neurodivergent kid and mocks it. Such a person cannot be defended. Does anyone seriously think otherwise?)

Yet, to put those posts in the same category as the "furry / cosplayer / ... cringe compilations" is strange (to put it mildly). Because what's radically ignored here is: "Isn't <something romantic> weird?" and the like can be interpreted charitably. It might not have a nasty motivation but come from genuine frustration, confusion, cognitive overload or anxiety.

I'm all for efforts to be nicer and quit / restrict / hide the stuff mentioned. I wouldn't miss that stuff. But maybe, maybe, members of a marginalized community, in their own space, should be interpreted charitably? And that's seriously lacking sometimes. I know that a couple of users left because of this.

Different strokes for different folks I guess. People are allowed to think its gross or enjoy it. It doesn’t hurt anyone.

"considered okay" yeah but I'd hope they mean okay for them. Sucks when all the aros are bunched together under a set strict guidelines. like hey man, chill. it's a spectrum. don't talk shit about the things other people do, they could very well say the same things about you. golden rule or whatever

Kissing can sometimes be viewed as sexual. There are a lot of aro aces so in the aro community who are repulsed by the sexual implications. Also kissing on the lips is the signature move for every modern romantic movie / book. 
 

Kissing carries strong romantic and sexual connotations. Im not surprised some aros aren’t comfortable with it. 
 

With the societal context in mind how is the typical aro view on kissing hypocritical? 

 

Furthermore

You can think an activity is gross, repulsive or weird while also thinking it’s okay for others to do said thing. 

Sex repulsed asexuals don’t think it’s not okay for others to have sex for instance. They can still think sex is gross and repulsive and voice their opinion on the matter.

Same for aros who don’t like kissing.

Aros can find kissing weird or not understand the why but still respect others right to engage and enjoy that activity.

It only becomes an issue if gatekeeping happens, but I’ve never seen kiss averse aros gatekeep smooching aros. 

There's actually quite a big asexual kink community. If you would feel better asking anonymously, try any of the tumblrs: millenniumfae, fuckyeahasexual, or platonikink (may be inactive). If you're over 18, I also have the invite to a Kinky Aces discord I can invite you to. And here is a kink-specific thread over on AVEN: https://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/105805-kink-bdsm-and-cake/?tab=comments#comment-1060869891

You can also DM me if you'd like. I'm asexual and have delved into kinks, though I'm not super active in the physical scene. At the very least, I may be able to point you in a better direction if I know more. :)

No pressure either way! I know how intimidating and nervewracking it can be to open up about this.

@SkyTuneRein may also be very knowledgeable on this, especially from a researched perspective of you not being alone in this! They may be another person to share thoughts with, if (and only if) you would both be happy to communicate with each other in this way! 

@AroAcedragon13 Yes!

I can give some insight to the anon results from my poll, including numbers of particular kinks. If we get a bunch more takers or enough samples for each selection, then we don't have long to wait before I publish the first charts, if that'll help.

I have a particular kink/fet too which has made me question my (a)sexuality, as well as sanity at one point, even though it's not that bad. It's something that I'm comfortable admitting and talking about, but not with a large and open audience, or on a public forum. It can be a great way to bond, at least if done right, but, like many kinks, can be mistaken or mis-associated with things that isn't acceptable, not to mention it also, like other kinks, can evoke disgust to at least some who don't share it. So far my poll has more than 10% who at least partly shares it though.

My experience in the field is like my experience in relationships though - next-to-non-existent. So like hemogoblin, I've delved deep in the knowledge side but not in the physical. Being demi and with social anxiety, one can guess it's hard-at-best for me to share let alone practice. AVEN, however, was the first place I could open more and discuss sexual topics, and even mention some words, without a lot of people losing their heads or getting banned, so that helped.

I think that going along with this problem, people also forget about the grey-aros and the arofluxes, etc…  it’s really sad to see this happening.

Yeah, abusive relationships are a terrible problem that I am so sorry other people have happening to them, and some aros are like "I don't get it so your suffering isn't valid". I don't understand how people can be so terrible and I'm really, really, really sorry on behalf of all aros.

It also completely shits on aros & aces who have also been trapped in abusive relationships, there are aroallos in abusive FWBs, there are alloaces in abusive marriages, aroaces in abusive QPRs. Aroace minors in abusive family situations??

@CanadianBird It never used to be like this two years ago, then things started getting really weird. Some also encourage cringe culture and other borderline ableist and outright homophobic things. A few months ago, the mods even tried to prohibit any mention of the word 'sex' to avoid "upsetting the asexuals in the sub". THAT turned out as well as you imagined, backlash from all sides was swift and they since backflipped on the decision. Last rule they tried to tried implementing was something like 'no bashing people for experiencing romantic attraction' the mods are not at all enforcing of that rule as many negative comments & towards romantic people have either slipped through the cracks or have just had a bandaid put on the them (the last post I saw was just days ago and was comparing romantic attraction to symptoms of schizophrenia (they do that a lot there), the post was subscentally locked but never actually removed and as far as I know, the OP who posted their "take" was never held accountable)

Yeah, I’m the creator of voidpunk and the subreddit + its associated discord server is so rancid I had to leave. I tried repeatedly to get them to stop behaving like that but the mods were never on my side. It’s vile

@Jot-Aro Kujo I was not aware that you were the original creator! That's soo cool! My sympathies for having your label being destroyed by utter assholes :(

I can understand what you say for some reason I feel the same way about non romantic songs. Well there is some exceptions but only a few. Myself I love the Backstreet boys that only sing about love, can't help it just love AJ MCLEAN's voice, I am enjoying listening to their songs even if I don't relate to these feelings. (I know it is an old boysband but I am 38 and grew up with them. Bruno Mars' music is cool too  

As a person who listens to Asian pop boy bands, I understand completely lol 

Glad to know  I am not the only one!! I love this forum it so great to talk to people like me, who lives the same things and feel the same way.?

😢 Heartbreaks are always downplayed, even the word is strangely cutesy. While I also don't "get them", at least I understand that they are very traumatic and painful and wish you healing!

I'm sorry to hear that. I don't know what I could say, but if it would make you feel better, then feel free to talk to me!! Either way I hope you'll  be alright!!

I'm so sorry. Six years is a long time. That's a hard break up. Just take it day by day and take care of yourself. We are here for you. 

I'm really sorry.. I hope you can feel better. I'm always here if ya need it ofc.

It's really hard, especially if you suffer any sort of mental illness, to not let the loud negative voices outweigh the supportive positive ones. I have found practicing mindfulness to be helpful with this. It helps me to stop and take pause and realize "oh this negative voice hurts more, so I put more weight on it, but [look at all the people on this post who have spoken against the negativity. Remember these circumstances in the past where people accepted me without fight or argument or interrogation, etc.]." It's really an invaluable skill that will benefit you in so many areas.

I have also made the tough decision to leave communities before because they were harming my mental health even knowing there were good parts to it. If that's what you need to do, that's 100% something you should do. But please think hard about if you're making this decision to help your mental health (meaning, you will also work on replacing this space with good self-care - such as self-validation regarding being valid as an aro - and concentrated efforts to support your mental health) or simply to further punish yourself (falling into the negative spiral of "well, I'm not wanted here, so I should be alone and not near anyone so I can't bother them or upset them or ever hurt anyone ever again with my mere existence").

Best of luck. I wish you very well, and I hope you're able to accept that you're a true aro and that the random negative voices will become easier to shake off.

@hemogoblin I'm not sure, but it feels like both to me.

Yikes, I've never encountered this and I am so glad. I was in a physically and emotionally abusive friendship. Thinking that we're immune is so dangerous.

Same thing for me. I'm aro, I won't get myself in a toxic relationship. However I did go through really toxic friendships, never realized it, and and decide to accept everything that the person could do... Because they were a friend

@Antiochit's quite common on the r/aromantic subreddit, tho tbf the sub itself is full of batshit people who think aros can never experience negative relationships, only aphobia.

@Atypique I was also in a toxic friendship and it nearly killed me, I only thought those in romantic relationships were abusive at the time. I was totally wrong.

grayrose ppl ftw

Huh, what label were you using before, again!

Congratulations, by the way!

@Storm_leopardcat I just considered myself an allosexual pan

Oh wow, so they are gatekeeping? Nasty. No one can know how other people feel and/or experience themselves. Telling someone their feelings are ‘wrong’ or ‘lesser’ is the sort of moral superiority that makes me sick. You do you @Lovebird

Yeah, I get this sort of condescending tone from the ace community at times, by virtue of being sex favourable and having a libido. Some people really just need to stop and consider just what they're doing with their lives to think that they need to make sure everyone who identifies one way meets their standards of said identity

@Nix @Deltalorian It's to a point where I no longer choose to engage in aro communities too often because of the invalidation. I'm currently questioning if I'm asexual spec too and I really don't want to experience the the same troubles. I'm just tired of my private life being judged and I'm scared to find out if irl aro communities are just as bad. 

so true birds are my beloved 

I named myself lovebird for a reason ❤

a good display name choice 10/10

lol I totally understand the feeling though. I've only come out to myself recently so I've struggled with identifying with the LGBTQIA+ label since I'm essentially cishet, not to mention how the broader community doesn't fully acknowledge aromantics (and asexuals) quite yet. However, I have met a lot of allies within the community who are open-minded and welcoming, and don't treat me as lesser even if they don't understand everything yet. tl;dr you aren't lesser and don't let other people tell you otherwise

For me it's more like the general LGBTi+ community leaves me out bc I'm a enby femme romance-favourable greyromantic with a preference for men, like I look cishet to literally everyone else so 

For me, I believe there's no one right way of "looking" queer. Obviously there is some degree of privilege for people like us who may pass as cishet that we need to acknowledge. At the end of the day, though, that doesn't make us less valid to be queer. From my understanding, everyone can have different experiences, even ones that don't fit into more "traditional" narratives. Just because they're different, doesn't mean any one experience is less valid. To be honest I've only been out to myself for less than a year so my thoughts might not be that well formed, but hey it's always nice to talk about things. :D

...Boo!

Aw yis 🎃✨

Woot!

Yay for Random Access Memories! 

What are your fave Daft Punk tracks, Lovebird? Would this be one of them?

Veridis Quo, Doing it Right, Touch, probably a billion more I cannot think of but those are my top favourite.

same it's honestly cool what some people come up with 

When tumblr was at its peak people were making purposely bad looking cards with suggestive puns in comic sans for different fandoms, and I remember making one for my favourite band, DEVO, the text saying something like "I wanna see ur space junk" referencing their song Space Junk. It was the funniest thing I ever came up with at the time.  

OMG, 2 weeks, how did you cope?

I bought a tablet lmao, all the Youtube I want!

The myth that aros don't, want to, date is quite persistent.

I blame both allo and aro communities because they've started this idea that 'aro = no romance' like yes, we may not be able to experience attraction but that doesn't stop us from wanting or liking romantic coded things. I've seen way too many aros ask why an arospec would want to date or like dating, like why do you care so much??  

Most social issues can't just be simplified into "x bad, y good", anyway.

Tell that to r/aromantic where they bitch & moan about allos- every. freaking. day. 

I'm not here as an aro person in aro safe spaces, to bully allos for existing. I am here to discuss how being greyromantic affects me in an allo world. I want to live in a world where we all live in peace, none of this "I'm better than you" bullshit.

What bought this on was a cringy virgin vs chad meme. The virgin (allo) was portayed as a stricty monogamous (polyamourous allos didn't exist to OP apparently), deals with breakups (allos apparently haven't had to deal with friendship breakups), no flag (the allosexual flag is a thing, but it's super uncommon & not even other allos use it so i'm giving a pass on OP for this one), always prioritises romance (stereotyping allos as hypersexual/romantic... totally not repackaged homophobia). The chad (aro) was no monogamy (polyamourous aros do exist lol), cool flag (based tho), no breakups (not like aros have had to leave toxic QPRs or anything), understands the 'value of friendship' (aplatonic is a thing~) and of course forgetting greyros & demiros exist episode 4674.

Someone actually did call OP out for the meme, calling it exclusionary and such. But everyone just kept saying "it's just a meme!"          

Why not under "Aromantic Discussion"? Bet a lot of people would love to join in!

Maybe. I'm just not the kinda person to vent in the open, but this has been a thing that's been chewing me up for a while and I've broken down a few times over it. But idk if people will care or have proper answers. 

Ooooooo, congrats on figuring it out! :))))))