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What is your gender? (select all you identify with)  

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I haven't seen a poll like this yet, but I was quite curious, because to me it seemed as if there are an above-average amount of fellow enbys on here.

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Non binary , my gender is… not quite agender so i use neutral.

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Not sure what all these terms are for. Human bodies come in two basic varieties, male and female. For personality and presentation, three terms seem helpful: masculine, feminine and androgynous. Everything else seems sort of scholastic.

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7 hours ago, Blazkovitz said:

Human bodies come in two basic varieties, male and female

And intersex. They exist too. But i am not intersex myself so i am not the one who will talk about it with you.

 

7 hours ago, Blazkovitz said:

For personality and presentation, three terms seem helpful: masculine, feminine and androgynous. Everything else seems sort of scholastic.

That however that concern me. I am not sure i understand what you are talking about… you know we are talking about gender right? Not look…

And non binary is not just "between man and woman" . It's anything that is not 100% man or woman. My gender is not "androgynous" but i am very not a man or a woman.

 

 

Edit : oh wait you're Spacenik86... you said some transphobic stuff before and never seemingly learned from it. Never mind. 

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On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 12:17 PM, Blazkovitz said:

Not sure what all these terms are for. Human bodies come in two basic varieties, male and female. For personality and presentation, three terms seem helpful: masculine, feminine and androgynous. Everything else seems sort of scholastic.

Did you ever heard about intersex people? Most of the time they are operate at birth so they can be male or female (which is most often a terrible thing or them, in particular when the sex that has been chose is "the wrong one"), and then have to take hormones or thing like that to complete because their body don't do it. Some people are spared from this operation and so they are not male or female, but this is not common because often doctors forced the parents to chose (however I think they are trying to change this, but I suppose it must be difficult). This operation is not a natural thing. Intersex is real, even if people prefer to forget it to keep it simple...

 

Also, I don't think your three terms are useful at all. What is androgynous? That sounds like a large category where a lot of things are melted. And I don't think it fits all non-binary people.

I'll be honest : I have a hard time understand all these things about genre, or why it is important for people. But I'm trying to, and I won't write this kind of statements. I actually think that to speak of something, you have to understand it (understand doesn't mean you have to experience it yourself, you can understand it on the intellectual level).

Plus, I Don't think that we can reduce this to personality and presentation as you say… I mean, I'm not feminine, but I'm still a woman.

 

Anyway, I am a ciswoman, tough I am not a "feminine" woman. For instance I don't understand make-up at all.

 

Sometimes I feel like there is more non-binary or trans people here, but maybe it's because I never met in real life (I think)? Sometimes I'm wondering if aromanticism or asexuality affect gender Identity. I Don't know, but I feel like some gender coded things are linked to seduction and gender-role in a couple Not everything, of course; but for instance, it seems for me that when it comes to clothes, a feminine style is often associated with seduction (like a boyfriend complaining because his girlfriend is not feminine enough, he thinks she doesn't seduce him without "feminine" clothes).

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21 hours ago, nonmerci said:

Did you ever heard about intersex people? Most of the time they are operate at birth so they can be male or female (which is most often a terrible thing or them, in particular when the sex that has been chose is "the wrong one"), and then have to take hormones or thing like that to complete because their body don't do it. Some people are spared from this operation and so they are not male or female, but this is not common because often doctors forced the parents to chose (however I think they are trying to change this, but I suppose it must be difficult). This operation is not a natural thing. Intersex is real, even if people prefer to forget it to keep it simple...

 

I know about intersex but it's quite rare so thinking too much about it distracts from the fundamental facts. You don't have 71 sexes like Facebook wants you to believe.

 

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Also, I don't think your three terms are useful at all. What is androgynous? That sounds like a large category where a lot of things are melted.

And I don't think it fits all non-binary people.

 

Can you give me examples of non-binary behaviour or presentation that is not androgynous or gender neutral?

I think my behaviour and presentation are quite neutral with some masculine bent in some aspects.

 

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I Don't know, but I feel like some gender coded things are linked to seduction and gender-role in a couple Not everything, of course; but for instance, it seems for me that when it comes to clothes, a feminine style is often associated with seduction (like a boyfriend complaining because his girlfriend is not feminine enough, he thinks she doesn't seduce him without "feminine" clothes).

 

That's a good point. What the point of gender without sex? Wouldn't it be like a sub-culture then?

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4 hours ago, Blazkovitz said:

Can you give me examples of non-binary behaviour or presentation that is not androgynous or gender neutral?

To begin you seem to use "androgynous" and "gender neutral" as synonymous while they are not for me. I understand androgynous as a mixed of masculine and feminine, and neutral as something who is no feminine nor masculine. Of course I can be wrong, as I am not a master of these notions; I'll let concerned people explain, it will be pretty interesting.

Then this thing with feminine/masculine is western-centered. In other cultures genres can be seen completely differently. I have to search for articles about it, but I know that some cultures see a lot more genres than that. I know some transgenres don't like this idea, but genre is mainly a social construct; and then, there is the way people place themselves in this social construct. But social construct change when you change the society or culture. 

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2 hours ago, nonmerci said:

To begin you seem to use "androgynous" and "gender neutral" as synonymous while they are not for me. I understand androgynous as a mixed of masculine and feminine, and neutral as something who is no feminine nor masculine.

 

This is also a fine point. For example a robot is gender neutral, but not androgynous. In my case though, androgynous works pretty well. I have some masculine traits like interest in warfare, and some feminine traits like need for emotional expression.

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3 hours ago, Blazkovitz said:

This is also a fine point. For example a robot is gender neutral, but not androgynous. In my case though, androgynous works pretty well. I have some masculine traits like interest in warfare, and some feminine traits like need for emotional expression.

I jut wanted to say that I would not call an interest in warfare a masculin trait and especially wouldn't call need for emotional expression a feminine trait. The latter is close to a basic human need, and the former has more to do with upbringing and education (which might be influenced by gender) than with gender.

 

 

My stance on sex and gender is that i pretty much don't care. When it comes to sex i got kind of lucky with being male, as it aligns with my interests and tends to give you more possibilities in society (and menstrual period sounds really painful).

Gender never really was a thing that interested me. Identifying as male is just the easiest choice, but I think if things were different I wouldn't have many problems with adapting.

 

 

On 12/1/2019 at 2:06 PM, nonmerci said:

Sometimes I feel like there is more non-binary or trans people here, but maybe it's because I never met in real life (I think)? Sometimes I'm wondering if aromanticism or asexuality affect gender Identity. I Don't know, but I feel like some gender coded things are linked to seduction and gender-role in a couple Not everything, of course; but for instance, it seems for me that when it comes to clothes, a feminine style is often associated with seduction (like a boyfriend complaining because his girlfriend is not feminine enough, he thinks she doesn't seduce him without "feminine" clothes).

I think that romantic and sexual attraction plays a big part in defining gender. At least I think that for me, gender would be even more irrelevant if I wasn#T sexually attracted towards women. (And why would somebody ever complain about his girlfriend not wearing feminine/"seductive" clothes? First of all, it's her choice what she wants to wear, and on top of that, in my opinion, sexual attraction is just distracting most of the time and I'd be glad if everybody wore androgynous clothes).

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10 hours ago, Tagor said:

And why would somebody ever complain about his girlfriend not wearing feminine/"seductive" clothes? First of all, it's her choice what she wants to wear

I don't know, but I see some people do it. I suppose that some kind of sexist thing, like "you see this sexy woman? She is miiiiiiiiine".

 

10 hours ago, Tagor said:

My stance on sex and gender is that i pretty much don't care. When it comes to sex i got kind of lucky with being male, as it aligns with my interests and tends to give you more possibilities in society (and menstrual period sounds really painful).

Gender never really was a thing that interested me. Identifying as male is just the easiest choice, but I think if things were different I wouldn't have many problems with adapting.

I got you. I identify as woman because I am born woman, and I'm not sure if it would change if I was born man. Sometimes I think I may still identify as a woman, but sometimes no. I think I would still don't care. As I said, I don't think about my gender as a personality trait (maybe more as a combinaison of personality traits?), I don't think it affects my personality at all (maybe it is the other way around, my personality affects how I see gender?). It's not something I ever think about it. Is doesn't care a cis thing, or are there cis that actually cares?

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